It's something that we have deep in us to resist this constant insult as the deplorables,

you know, as the ones clinging to religion and guns, as uneducated.

And I'm glad to see this revolt, you know, of the working class and this demand for nationalism,

because, you know, national pride and economic nationalism is more often the way that working

people get, you know, benefits from a society, you know, the working people need to demand

some national allegiance and some some national binding with the with the ruling elites.

Yeah, I'm very excited about that.

Hello, welcome back to the Brendan O'Neill show with me, Brendan O'Neill,

and my special guest this week, Michael Schellenberger, Michael, welcome to the show.

Good to be back, Brendan, good to see you.

Yeah, I should say welcome back to the show, you're a returning guest.

We love having you on, and there's always far too much for us to talk about,

because your knowledge is wide-ranging, famously so.

But let's try and talk about as much as we can.

I definitely want to get your view on American politics and where things are at right now,

but I do want to kick off with something you've been writing about for a few years,

which is the climate change issue, because it's back in the news, it's never really out of the news,

but it's kind of having one of its resurgent moments.

We've just come out of COP27 with a kind of deal to help the third world.

Just stop oil are going slightly off the rails, and I think are really pointing to the more

deranged element in climate apocalypse politics.

Greta Thunberg is accusing people of greenwashing.

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