So hello, everybody. I am delighted to be here with Aiden Hart.

Aiden Hart is an iconographer. He is a writer. And for me, it's very personal because he's also,

let's say, someone who came before me as an icon carver, someone who represented icon carving

to an Orthodox world that had forgotten a little bit about that tradition. And so very early in my own career,

I reached out to Aden for advice and for criticism.

He was always very gracious to give it.

But beyond that, he has written several books on iconography.

I would say the Bible of iconography.

And he's also written about theory.

He's done so many things. And so I'm very delighted and grateful to have written about theory. He's done so many things.

And so I'm very delighted and grateful to have him with me today.

This is Jonathan Pajot. Welcome to the symbolic world.

Iden, thank you for coming to talk to us.

Thank you, Jonathan. Thank you for your honor of finally having time with you.

Exactly.

I've known you so well through our correspondence,

because here face to face, virtually.

Virtually, exactly.

Virtually.

Yeah, several years ago, I had the hope of, you know,

going to England and studying with you and doing all that things,

but, you know, then, then reality of being

...