Hey everybody this is Aubrey Chavez from Faith Matters.

In early 2021 in the wake of January 6th,

McKay Coppins contacted Mitt Romney with a bold request.

He wanted to write a biography about him.

But McKay has stipulations. Not only would he have to have full access to the senator, he also wanted to retain full editorial control. And to his surprise, Romney agreed. And shortly he'd send him stacks of journal entries, emails, and texts.

They met over 45 times over the coming years for lengthy interviews.

And McKay also interviewed many of Romney's closest friends and family and colleagues. That unprecedented access has now turned into a book

called Romney A Reckony, which just debuted at number three overall on the New York Times

bestsellers list. We hope that this interview would offer a unique take on this subject and we spent some real time on questions of integrity and culpability and faith.

McKay brought not only deep insight into the psyche of one of the most fascinating and in some cases polarizing political figures of our time,

but he also brought really clear-eyed discernment of his own.

He helped us work through some other fascinating questions.

What does it take to live on the edge of inside?

And what does it cost?

Is it possible to stave off cynicism

while remaining pragmatic about having impact for good?

McKay Coppins is a staff writer at the Atlantic where he covers politics, religion, and

national affairs.

He's a former visiting fellow at the University of Chicago's Institute of Politics

and has won the Aldo Beckman Award from the White House Correspondence Association

for his coverage of the Trump presidency and the Wilbur Award for Religion Journalism.

This was an incredibly fun interview for us to record and we're so incredibly grateful that

...