What's up everybody? This is Cortland from IndieHackers.com and you're listening to the

IndieHackers podcast. On this show, I talked to the founders of profitable internet businesses,

and I try to get a sense of what it's like to be in their shoes. How do they get to where

they are today?

How do they make decisions, both with their companies and in their personal lives? And what exactly makes their businesses tick? And the goal here, as always, is so that the rest of us can learn from their examples and go on to build our own profitable internet businesses. If you're enjoying the show, you should leave a review for us on Apple Podcasts. one of the best ways to give back and support the show and help other people find it.

So I really appreciate it.

And today's episode, I see... You should leave a review for us on Apple Podcasts. It's one of the best ways to give back and support the show and help other people find

it. So I really appreciate it. In today's episode, I sat down with Rob Walling, the founder of Tiny Seed. Rob is somewhat of a recurring guest on the show. I like talking to him because he has such a wide perspective of what's going on. He was a founder and a bootstrapper. He grew his company drip to an exit worth many millions of dollars.

He now invest in companies at Tiny Seed, where he gets He was a founder and a bootstrapper. He grew his company drip to an exit worth many millions of dollars.

He now invest in companies at Tiny Seed, where he gets a very wide purview to see all sorts of trends and opportunities.

And so in this conversation, we talk about what it takes to start a successful SaaS company as an anti-hacker in October 2020.

Not 10 years ago, not five years ago, but right now, today.

We cover the different trends and opportunities that you should be aware of.

We ask the question whether or not you should start an info product instead of a SaaS company,

given how crowded and competitive SaaS has become.

And we take a look at how some of Rob's portfolio companies are coming up with their ideas,

finding their niches, and competing

in such a crowded market. It's obviously a lot to cover, but I really enjoyed this type of

conversation and I hope to do this format more often. So I hope you enjoy the episode as well.

What are some new things you're seeing with SaaS companies today then? I mean, I think there's

quite a bit because, you know, marketing channels that everybody thinks

about, they all have a half-life, right? So cold email started getting big in 2011, 2012 when

...