The following is a conversation with Michael Malis and Yaron Brooke.

Michael's third time on this podcast and Yaron's second, but together for the first time.

Michael is an anarchist, political thinker, host of a podcast called Your Welcome,

and author of Dear Reader, The New Right, and two upcoming books, Anarchist Handbook and The White Pill.

Yaron is an objectivist philosopher, chairman of the Iron Rand Institute, host of the Yaron Brooke Show,

and co-author of The Free Market Revolution, and equal is unfair.

Quick mention of our sponsors, ground news, public goods, athletic greens, brave, and forcigmatic.

Check them out in the description to support this podcast.

As a side note, let me say that this conversation is a kind of experiment.

Both Michael and Yaron are thoughtful and passionate, united in part by an interest in the history and philosophy of Iron Rand.

But they are also very different in style.

Good conversation, like good food, is often made delicious by pairing of contrasting elements.

For example, someone suggested I try a peanut butter, bacon, and banana sandwich,

which apparently is very good.

Among the three of us, I don't know who's the peanut butter, who's the bacon, and who's the banana.

I'm guessing it's probably me. I'm the banana.

But I hope the final result, the final dish, if you will, is equally delicious.

We talk through, I think, a lot of interesting ideas.

Sometimes, disagreeing, sometimes, even, in rare cases, saying something humors, including dark humor,

especially Michael's case.

All three of us are sensitive to the suffering in the world today and throughout human history.

We think about it, we talk about it, and we deal with it in different ways.

...