Let's say your house surrounded by a gate a 20 foot wall.

So when climbs that gate, they climb that wall,

they're in your front yard, your backyard,

is 3 a.m. in the morning.

You cannot shoot them for that.

Just as a matter of fact, them being on your property.

They're committing the crime.

You can't shoot them for that. They have to be doing something else.

Break into your house, trying to kill you. They have to be doing something else before you can use daily force to stop.

Let's go.

Welcome to Citizen.

Welcome to Citizen. We've got a special guest today. Michael Cargill, you were the owner of Central Texas Gunworks as well as the owner of a Supreme Court case.

So two things.

Plaintiff.

Plaintiff.

Is that what they call it?

Before we get into all that, let's get into your background.

Where are you from originally from Fort Lauderdale, Florida.

Florida got the man. Yeah, went into the military and served 12 years of the United States

Army. Got an Army back in 1999, and then I started a trucking company, moving elevators

around the country.

Also did a little project manager for a telecommunications company, installing DSL around the country,

...