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Listening to America

#1704 A New Perspective and Book on Lewis and Clark

Listening to America

Listening to America

Society & Culture, History

4.61.1K Ratings

🗓️ 19 May 2026

⏱️ 57 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

Clay interviews Craig Fehrman, the author of an important new book on Lewis and Clark, This Vast Enterprise: A New History of Lewis and Clark. Fehrman approaches the great story of the Lewis and Clark Expedition by viewing it through the eyes of the often-overlooked participants: Sergeant John Ordway, Clark's enslaved valet York, and Sacagawea. Rigorously researched and grounded in actual historical discoveries, this book will be essential reading for students of the Lewis and Clark Expedition. In his footnotes, Fehrman begins with a truly remarkable short essay on his methods and historiography. These essays, which amount to 40,000 words, are alone proof that his work needs to be taken seriously. And he's great fun to interview. This episode was recorded on April 9, 2026.

Transcript

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0:00.0

This is my podcast introduction to an interview I just did with Craig Furman.

0:08.6

Craig Furman has written a new book about the Lewis and Clark expedition, a major book,

0:14.4

This Vast Enterprise, A New History of Lewis and Clark.

0:17.8

It's just out, Avid Reader Press.

0:22.8

It's his second book.

0:24.0

His previous book was about presidents writing, author and chief, which got extraordinary reviews, including in the Wall Street Journal.

0:34.1

Greg Furman lives in Indiana with his wife and children.

0:37.3

And the book is going to be in the bookstores within days here.

0:41.4

I've read the book carefully.

0:43.6

I've marked up the margin hundreds of times.

0:46.6

Um, I disagree with some things in this book, but it is an important piece of scholarship.

0:54.0

And at the end, he does something really truly

0:56.7

remarkable. Before he begins his footnotes on chapter X, whatever it's about, Sacajawea, as he

1:03.0

calls her, or York, the enslaved man, or Lewis, or Clark, or John Ordway, the first sergeant.

1:08.9

He has a little essay on his historiography, how he

1:12.4

searched the book, what's speculative and what's not, the secondary and tertiary sources that

1:18.9

he consulted. He provides a really interesting sort of essay perspective on each of the chapters

1:24.8

that he's writing. If you get the book, I would urge you to read those essays at the end in the footnotes

1:32.7

before you read the chapter because it will help you understand, help you negotiate his

1:37.1

methodology.

1:38.2

Anyway, it's an important book.

1:40.5

And my friend David Nacandri and I have been having this debate about it. I'm more critical

...

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