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You wrote The Precipice in 2019, I think. It came out in 2020.

And it's all about existential risks to humanity. You cover climate change,

nuclear war, you talk about pandemics, and you say at one point in that book, the case for

existential risk from AI, artificial intelligence, is clearly speculative. Indeed, it's the most

speculative case for a major risk in this book.

Is that still the case?

Yeah, it's certainly less speculative now. Back in 2020, there were a lot of people who just wouldn't take it seriously at all.

So I wanted to point out that it is a contentious issue among the experts, unlike

some of these other risks where they've got a better idea about the probabilities and how

bad they could be. Some of other risks, such as super volcanic eruptions, you know, and

things, are somewhat contentious among the experts, but not at the level that

AI is, where it's contentious that these powerful systems will be built, and it's contentious

as to whether they threaten us. But with the statement that so many people signed, so many

leaders of the top labs, you know, suggesting that, well, stating that AI posed a

...