Quick heads up before we start.

This episode is sponsored by the company behind the technology that we're discussing today.

They paid for this episode.

That means this conversation is a bit different from my normal interviews.

I'm still asking questions I think you'd want answered,

but this episode should be understood as sponsored content rather than an independent investigation like most of the show.

As always, do your own research, make up your own mind,

and consult a qualified expert before doing anything that affects your health and well-being. Welcome to the show. I'm Jordan Harbinger. On the Jordan Harbinger show, we decode the story, secrets and skills, the world's most fascinating people, and turn their wisdom into practical advice that you can use to impact your own life and those around you. Our mission is to help you become a better informed, more critical thinker through long-form conversations with a variety of amazing folks, from spies to CEOs, athletes, authors, thinkers, and performers, even the occasional arms dealer, drug trafficker, former jihadi, or a real-life hacker. If you're new to the show or you're looking for a handy way to tell your friends about it. I suggest our episode starter packs. These are collections of our

favorite episodes on topics like persuasion and negotiation, psychology, geopolitics, disinformation, China, North Korea, crime and cults, and more. It'll help new listeners get a taste of everything that we do here on the show. Just visit jordanharbinger.com slash start or search for us in your

Spotify app to get started. Today on the show, Bjorn Ekeberg is the co-founder and CEO of recharge

health creators of FlexBeam. This is a targeted infrared therapy device designed to naturally

accelerate recovery time for active individuals, looking to heal injuries, manage musculoskeletal

pain or improve energy, reduce inflammation. There's a lot of things that red light therapy does that is actually kind of surprising. I was taken by surprise a lot of the research I did for this episode actually. He's got a PhD in the philosophy of science, speaks internationally on the universe and the nature of light, which is like, this is a pretty heavy topics here. However, we're going to talk about red light therapy. I'm a skeptic. You all know that. But this actually does have evidence that it does real things, just not everything that you read on the internet. Of course, Bjorn talks some sense into us and talks about his device, the Flex Beam, which I've got here in my hand. It's quite a high quality production. I was quite happy with it. This sponsored content is brought to you with limited interruption by recharge health and flex beam.

So thanks to them for sponsoring this episode. Here we go with Bjorn Ekeberg. I will say when I got this thing, I was like, oh, this is pretty, it's hefty, right? It's a heavy, a heavy item. I get a lot of stuff in the mail. You know, I get a lot of stuff from sponsors or get a lot of stuff from health companies. And it's amazing how when you open it, you go, oh, it's one of these things. Or they're like, whoa, this thing is. So this thing was heavy and it came in this nice case. And I know that this is cognitive bias in part, but you can kind of tell how much somebody's

invested at least into a product by the case and the battery capacity. And even this could be

half my imagination, but even the type of plastic on the outside or the amount of metal they use,

because there's just a huge difference between something that costs like $40 to manufacture and something that costs $400 to manufacture. I know, again, I know it's partly cognitive bias, but it's like, okay, if you're going to put metal on here and it's going to come in a nice case and it's going to have like heavy ABS and it's going to have good quality Velcro straps, then they at least care about the quality of the product. And it's like, yes, that doesn't say

that all of the science is settled behind whatever principle is in there, but it does say that this is

not a ridiculous sort of sham where they're selling a high margin product made, you know, in a

crappy way to Robs, hopefully.

Indeed.

When you order something like this and if it comes to safety goggles, you're like, okay,

...