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Phil, Naesh, welcome to the show. Thanks. Great to be on. Pleasure to be here.

What exactly is the Big Bang, Phil? Well, people think they know,

but actually there's quite a bit of controversy as to what we even mean by the term Big Bang.

So we talk about two definitions, the hot Big Bang, and that's just the idea that the universe

evolved from a very hot, dense state. And then

after that, it's expanded and expanded and it called and then galaxies formed and then planets

formed and us. But there's another definition of the Big Bang, which we might call the Big Bang

singularity.

That says that 14 billion years ago, time stopped ticking.

This was the beginning of the universe.

So that's based off of theorems proven by Penrose and Hawking.

And what's interesting is that neither Penrose nor Hawking actually stood by those theorems.

They actually think that some of the assumptions in the theorem don't hold in reality.

And so maybe we shouldn't trust the idea that the Big Bang was the beginning.

And in fact, Niayash and I went to a large conference in Copenhagen,

and we surveyed physicists. We asked some all sorts of controversies within the field.

And in fact, the only one where we got a majority view was that the Big Bang should not be

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