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Hello, I'm Matthew Price and this is Beyond Today on BBC Radio 4.

We ask one big question about one big story every day.

Today why would you stab someone?

Two families, one in London.

Two families, one in London and one in Cheshire are trying to deal with the biggest shock that perhaps anyone can go through.

They'll be getting phone calls and messages of support at the moment. The police will be helping them and for a long time they will grieve.

Both families have lost a 17 year old in perhaps the most brutal way.

In Cheshire it was a boy called Eusef in London. in stabbings that we don't know. But we wanted to find out why people carry knives, why they use them.

And in a moment we're going to hear from a guy called Jay who did both. But we first wanted

to hear from Greg Mackenzie, a reporter for BBC London. This

year alone he's covered 18 murders. The latest was the death of Jody Chesney from Romford at the weekend in what's been described as a completely

unprovoked attack.

I get the call, I come in at 4 in the morning and whatever's happened overnight I will go out and have to get the interviews and get the intel and often I'll be first at that time so you'll get the early risers

you'll get the families will still some that are still at the scene especially if it's been at

like one in the morning there's been a stabbing you'll see the families around and it's my

job then to try and engage with them and often you know they will tell you where to go

in and not around about words but you know they will tell you where to go in there not a roundabout words but

you know often they will talk to me and with this murder what's different is you know

often you'll hear stuff or see stuff on Twitter on on social media kind of this crews against

that crew it's gang related it's this it's that this one slightly different I'm

not getting that this time in terms of the reasons family saying unprovoked attack and at this

...