What Next | Trump’s Weaponized IRS

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4 • 1.1K Ratings

🗓️ 15 April 2025

⏱️ 29 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

On April 7, the Treasury Department and Department of Homeland Security reached an agreement to allow ICE to use confidential tax information to locate undocumented immigrants. Though this group generally pays taxes at a higher rate than comparable U.S. citizens, advocates warn that the IRS-ICE team-up could have a chilling effect. They say it’s likely to endanger the $66 billion in federal tax revenue undocumented immigrants are estimated to contribute, and add to a climate of fear in communities nationwide. Guest: Francine Lipman, law professor at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas. Want more What Next? Join Slate Plus to unlock full, ad-free access to What Next and all your other favorite Slate podcasts. You can subscribe directly from the What Next show page on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Elena Schwartz, Paige Osburn, Anna Phillips, Madeline Ducharme, Ethan Oberman, and Rob Gunther. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0	On any given year, if you're an accountant, today is a busy day.
0:09.7	It's April 15th.
0:11.3	It's tax day.
0:13.3	But this year hits different.
0:15.9	One big change, Elon Musk's Department of Government Efficiency has already made its way through the IRS.
0:23.6	In the middle of a busy tax season, their workforce was diminished by 6,000 jobs.
0:31.6	America's tax-collecting agency has blown through three directors since Donald Trump became president again.
0:38.5	Not surprisingly, this chilling effect is resonating through the population to U.S. citizens.
0:48.5	That's Professor Francine Lippmann.
0:51.3	She's a tax law professor at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas.
0:55.0	We're hearing anecdotally from CPAs and enrolled agents that U.S. citizens are saying,
1:03.0	well, do I have to file taxes? And my understanding is the IRS is going to be eliminated
1:09.0	and replaced with tariffs.
1:13.1	When it comes to taxes, Professor Lippman has done everything.
1:18.0	She's worked as a CPA for an accounting firm, as a CFO for a business.
1:22.8	There was a stint in big law, two terms as Nevada's tax commissioner.
1:30.8	The resume is long. But for much of her career, she's made time for a group she calls unauthorized immigrants. One thing that I can say,
1:37.9	having worked with this group of individual taxpayers for two decades is that they treasure more than many U.S.
1:49.8	citizens their documents, meaning they have very close in hand their birth certificates,
1:58.3	often their passport, their other documents from their home country, including
2:05.7	they treasure any driver's license or other picture ID.
2:11.7	So they have documents.
	...

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