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Woman's Hour

Weekend Woman’s Hour: Davina McCall, Papua New Guinea, Jung Chang, Fawning, Sophie Ellis Bextor

Woman's Hour

BBC

Society & Culture, Health & Fitness, Personal Journals

4.22.9K Ratings

🗓️ 13 September 2025

⏱️ 56 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

Davina McCall, one of TV’s most popular presenters has a new book out, Birthing, co-written with the midwife, Marley Henry. Davina joined Anita Rani to talk about her stellar career so far, including hosting Big Brother for 10 years, campaigning for better menopause care and building a fitness empire. What makes her tick? And what drives her forward to clear hurdles such as an usual childhood, drug addiction and most recently, brain surgery for a benign tumour that she nicknamed Jeffrey?

As the 50th anniversary of Papua New Guinea's independence from Australia approaches later this month, we hear why the country is currently one of the most dangerous places in the world to be a woman. Two-thirds of women in PNG have experienced some form of sexual violence in their lifetime, which is almost twice the global average. Nuala McGovern was joined by Tahina Booth, a former elite athlete and founder of Grass Skirt Project who is trying to break the cycle of gender-based violence through sport and Joku Hennah, a journalist and activist.

Jung Chang’s Wild Swans, the epic family memoir that followed the lives of Jung, her mother and grandmother through China's 20th century, was banned in mainland China, but was a smash hit worldwide upon publication in 1991. Now Jung’s sequel, Fly, Wild Swans, brings her family’s story up to date and she joined Nuala to talk about its themes.

We’ve all heard of the fight or flight response in the face of danger, but there's also freeze, and then there's fawn, also known as people pleasing, or appeasing. Clinical psychologist Dr Ingrid Clayton has written about this in her new book, Fawning - Why the Need to Please Makes Us Lose Ourselves and How to Find our Way Back. Nuala spoke to Ingrid about her own experiences that made her want to help others overcome this form of trauma response and what fawning looks like in practice.

In 2023 Sophie Ellis-Bextor’s Murder on the Dancefloor went viral on TikTok after Emerald Fennell used it in a key scene in the film, Saltburn. That resurgence, along with her popular Kitchen Discos that got lots of us through the Covid lockdown set the scene for her new album, Perimenopop, which is released tomorrow, a celebration of womanhood in middle age. Sophie joined Anita in the Woman's Hour studio.

Presenter: Anita Rani Producer: Annette Wells Editor: Rebecca Myatt

Transcript

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0:00.0

You're dead to me.

0:05.0

No, no, that's the name of our podcast. Sorry.

0:08.7

And we're back for a brand new series.

0:11.1

Not only is it British history, it was a quill drop.

0:15.1

With more fun and facts from history without taking it too seriously.

0:19.8

Empress Matilda, what is she going to do now?

0:21.7

She decides to take back some of the jewels with her.

0:25.0

I'm taking these as well.

0:26.7

I'm going to come back for Tuscany one day as well.

0:29.2

You're dead to me.

0:30.6

Again, not you.

0:32.0

Name of the show.

0:32.8

Listen first on BBC Sounds.

0:35.0

Hello, I'm Anita Rani and welcome to Woman's Hour from BBC Radio 4.

0:39.8

Just to say that for rights reasons, the music in the original radio broadcast has been removed

0:44.8

for this podcast.

0:46.7

Hello and welcome to the programme.

0:48.9

Coming up, some of the highlights from this week.

0:51.4

TV, Queen and Menopause game changer Davina McCall is here to talk about her new book on birthing and life after her brain surgery.

0:59.6

We travel 9,000 miles to Papua New Guinea to hear from two women who are working to break the cycle of gender-based violence on the South Pacific Island.

1:08.1

Author Jung Chang, you might remember her best-selling book, Wild Swans. She now has a sequel, Fly Wild Swans. And Disco Queen, Sophie Ellis Bexter, is with us. Lots to get through, so let's crack on. First, Davina McCall is a TV presenter known for an enormous amount, the mass singer, My Mum, Your Dad,

1:28.8

Long Loss family, her new dating show stranded on honeymoon island, and Big Brother, of course.

...

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