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This is Science Friday.

I'm Flora Lixon.

Today on the podcast, understanding the complex relationship between mental health and chronic pain.

I think for some people, the message it's all in your head suggests that you're making it up.

And that would not follow the science at all.

Chances are you either have some type of chronic pain or you know somebody who does.

It's remarkably common.

Roughly 20% of adults in the U.S. live with it. And people with chronic pain are more likely to have depression, anxiety, and substance abuse disorders. But this relationship between physical and mental

health is not as straightforward as you might think,

and the latest research suggests that untangling the connections between mind and body

is a key part of developing better treatments for people who have chronic pain.

Joining me now is Science Friday producer Shoshana Bucksbaum, who has been reporting on this topic. Hi, Shoshana.

Hey, Flora. So let's back up for a minute and just like go through the basics. What exactly is chronic pain? You know, how is it defined?

Yeah. So chronic pain is just any pain that lasts longer than three months. It's sort of a big

umbrella term. It covers a wide variety of conditions. And it's kind of easy to think about

chronic pain based on where it happens in the body. So like a migraine versus lower back

pain. But chronic pain researchers have recently started to classify chronic pain conditions by

actually what's causing them. So is the pain the result of an injury, either to tissue or

nerve damage? And then there's this last type, which is not quite as well understood. And it's

pain that's due to changes in the mind and in the brain. And these

changes actually disrupt how your body processes the pain. And of course, to make it extra

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