This is CVS I on the world. I'm John Bachelor. Wall Street Journal headlines in these

last hours. The Valne's organization says his death followed prisoner swap proposal.

Journal reporting Russian opposition leader Alexi Naval's death in an Arctic penal colony followed a proposal to trade him and two unnamed

American citizens held by Moscow for a Russian hitman imprisoned in Germany, according Navalny's Foundation. I pause here because

this is one source but it's on the pages of the Wall Street Journal and I welcome

Katrina Vandenovell, the editorial director and

director and publisher of the nation magazine in addition to being a columnist for the

Washington Post.

Katrina a very good evening to you I expected our conversation would turn on the tragedy in Navalny.

Well, it does, except for we have this additional assertion by Navalny's sympathetic organization,

that he was murdered by the Kremlin because, and you fill in the blanks.

Murder is commonplace now, the president of the United States said he was murdered.

I was reminded immediately when I heard the news of he was

reduced to

reduced to the fate of Mikhail Khodorkovsky, the billionaire who was reduced to rags and sent to a penal colony in many years

in the early decades of this century.

And I learned from Professor Steve Cohen, your husband, the late Mr Cohen, that Horikovsky

was part of the decision-making that had made it the Kremlin at that time.

This is early Putin.

That the Kremlin was not going to let the jewels of Russia.

That would be the natural resources go into the

marketplace going to take possession of it that's all well and good the detail here that's

...