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listening. Terms apply. This is the Friends of History Debating Society. I'm John Batchelor. I welcome

Thadis McHodder writing at American greatness, or in Ukraine. Within these last

hours, surprising development. The President of the United States elect, the President of France,

and the President of Ukraine met at an event in Notre Dame in Paris for the rededication of a cathedral that

was damaged five years ago on a fire, the roof collapsed. The dedication went very well,

and the restoration is said to be magnificent, as if it was just built. At the same time, we were given a photograph

of the president-elect, the president of France, and the president of Ukraine standing next

to each other. Later on, we were given a quote saying that President Zelensky agrees with

Mr. Trump that the war must end. What does that mean?

That is, you report on an argument in America, which I've heard echoed in Europe and NATO,

that the Ukraine war is bleeding Russia. What does that mean, bleeding Russia?

Well, what it means is the cynical amongst us are saying that the purpose of the war,

for many people, is to bleed the Russian military,

to show fissures and sow divisions within the Russians,

because they are a threat to Europe.

The reason that I find this so offensive is the fact that we have an ally, our ally is the Ukrainians,

...