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What Next | Daily News and Analysis

The Russian “Collaborators”

What Next | Daily News and Analysis

Slate

News, Daily News, News Commentary, Politics

4.62.3K Ratings

🗓️ 8 February 2023

⏱️ 30 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

For Ukrainians who remained behind when the war began, choices made in the fog of occupation come under scrutiny when the invading army leaves, and neighbors once divided by the Russians again must live side by side. Guest: Joshua Yaffa, contributing writer at The New Yorker and the author of “Between Two Fires: Truth, Ambition, and Compromise in Putin's Russia.” If you enjoy this show, please consider signing up for Slate Plus. Slate Plus members get benefits like zero ads on any Slate podcast, bonus episodes of shows like Slow Burn and Amicus—and you’ll be supporting the work we do here on What Next. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to help support our work. Make an impact this Black History Month by helping Macy’s on their mission to fund UNCF scholarships for HBCU students. Go to macys.com/purpose to learn more. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0

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0:05.4

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0:38.0

and situations. Joshua Yafa has been reporting in Ukraine. And when I spoke to him,

0:51.4

earlier this week, it was as if he'd taken on this unofficial project, chronicling all the things

0:57.7

the war has broken in its path. He'd been spending time in an eastern city, known as Asium,

1:04.4

what immediately struck him as he arrived was that it wasn't just Russia making a mess of this

1:10.3

region. Pushing Russians out, that was messy too. Well, the first thing I saw on the way into town

1:20.8

was a highway littered with shrapnel glass burnt out Russian tanks by the side of the road.

1:27.4

Essentially, the remnants of what had been this lightning fast, super successful Ukrainian

1:33.6

counteroffensive that pushed Russian troops out of Asium and basically chased them all the way

1:37.6

down the highway and you could see the after effects of that chase on the way into Asium.

1:42.7

But when I got to the actual center of town, the destruction is apparent immediately. I mean,

1:50.9

the apartment buildings had clearly been bombed, shelled, cave-yard on themselves,

1:57.6

rubble around town, holes and buildings where they had been shelled, buildings

2:02.2

pockmarked with shrapnel bullet casings. I mean, it was clear that war had swept through town.

2:09.4

That was sort of unambiguous just in the physical look and feel of the city.

2:18.3

While he was in town, Joshua stayed in an abandoned apartment. There's plenty of available space

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