Amal Thippar is a judge on the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Sixth Circuit.

His new book is The People's Justice, Clarence Thomas, and the constitutional stories that define him.

That's our topic today. Welcome, Judge Thapar.

Thank you for having me. It's a treat to be here.

Am I pronouncing your last name right?

You are perfect.

Okay, very good, very good. Well, now, the format of the book, we'll start with that. The body of the book really is a study of a dozen specific Supreme Court decisions and Justice Thomas's reasoning in them sometimes in favor, sometimes as a dissent. But first, before we get into that, a little biographical

question, if I may ask, what was your first exposure to Justice Thomas's jurisprudence?

And did it have a first impression on you? Yeah, it came during my time in law school. When I went to law school, I was, Justice Thomas had just been nominated to the bench during that period.

And his confirmation hearings, as everyone knows, were on TV. And he talked a lot about originalism.

And it seemed to me I went to law school to understand how to interpret and become a lawyer.

And to me, when I heard Justice Thomas and Scalia explain how they interpreted documents,

it just made logical sense that you would interpret the words as they were understood when the law was passed.

And so really it was right from his confirmation hearings. I was exposed to him and had never heard of

him before. I went to law school with a completely open mind as to how to be a lawyer. But it seemed to me

when I got there, a lot of people, a lot of my classmates, brilliant people,

but they were talking about policy, not law, and I thought that belonged in my mind in the

political science school, and I was trying to figure out, okay, how will I advise a client,

what a law means, how will I do these things, telling them what the best policy is, doesn't

really get them there. And so

Justice Thomas and Justice Scalia were kind of the leading lights in this area at the time,

and that's where I was exposed to them. Now, as a lawyer and then a judge, you, of course,

...