Hello and welcome to Empire with me and Eta Anand.

And me, William, Thurumball.

Is that your attempt at bringing a half-arced pool back into the proceedings?

Is it? I thought we'd dealt with that.

It's quite a good pool, is that what? That was a good...

You've done better. You've done better.

Anyway, listen to... We're very privileged.

We have a very special guest here today who brings together so many threads of what we've been talking about in this series.

And actually asks the question, what was Empire all about?

And was it as bad as some people say?

I mean, you can kind of boil it down because we are in the middle of something of a war zone, particularly in Britain,

about the battleground as people who don't want you to talk about it at all,

and people who want to dig up things from the past and put it front and center on the table.

I think anywhere in the world people want to think well of their ancestors.

You don't grow up imagining that your ancestors were monsters.

And there is a long process of education which hasn't yet taken place in Britain

about what Empire means, that to rule another people in any period of history

means the use of violence, oppression, and the British did this as much as any other empire in history.

Anyway, we have an incredibly special guest, as I said.

You'll know her name if you listen to the news or read any newspapers,

and you might be scratching your head as to why.

But if I say the name Caroline Elkin to you, it will definitely resonate for those of you who are interested in Imperial history.

...