On Tuesday the 24th of March, our speakers will debate the motion,

this House believes we should abolish the licence fee.

Spectator Chairman Charles Moore and the telegraphs Alison Pearson

will propose the motion with Spectator editor Michael Gove

and former BBC America editor John Sopel opposing.

I'm Isabel Hardman and I'll be in the chair to maintain decorum and take your pressing questions.

Join us on Tuesday the 24th of March at 7pm and book your tickets at spectator.com

forward slash debate.

Hello and welcome to the Spectator's Book Club podcast. I'm Sam Leif, the literary editor of The Spectator. This week, I'm delighted to be joined by the novelist Howard Jeperson. His new book is called Howl. I'd like to start by asking you, Howard, about that title, if I may. I mean, you prefaced the book with an epigraph

from Alan Ginsberg. What was it that made it a Howley sort of book? It wasn't going to be called

Howell. Howell was my wife's idea, actually, my wife, who is my first reader. And that was her

response to the first couple of pages, which were not quite the same as the first couple of pages now.

She just reeled back from them.

She said, I'm feeling.

I'm being howled at.

And then we both heard that net word and paused.

Until then, it was something very...

I wanted to do some version of a statement that was made by a man on Shoah, who said he'd

been a car remember which camp he'd been in, but he said, if you were to lick my heart,

it would poison you.

And I thought, wow, that's a statement.

So I had the poison heart, and if you would lick my heart, I don't lick my heart, I do lick

...