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That's spycloud.com slash cyberwire and we thank spy cloud for sponsoring our show. Hello and welcome to SpyCast from the Secret Files of the International Spy Museum in Washington, D.C.

I'm Dr. Vince Hote, the Museum's historian and curator.

Every month, the museum brings you interesting talks

with authors, scholars, and practitioners who live in the world of global espionage.

Join us as we take a closer look at the secret world of intelligence.

Our guest today are Paul Crookshank and Tim Lister. Paul is a CNN terrorism analyst

and an investigative reporter specializing in al-Qaeda, ISIS, and jihadist terrorist groups.

He's an alumni fellow at the Center on Law and Security at New York University's School of Law

and previously worked as an investigative journalist in London, reporting on Al Qaeda and its European

affiliates, and was part of the CNN Reporting Team that covered the London July 7th, 2005 attacks.

Tim covered international news for over 25 years as a producer and reporter for the BBC and

CNN.

He has both lived and worked in the Middle East and has also worked in

Afghanistan and Pakistan. In 2004 he produced the award-winning documentary

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