Hi, this is Elena with Red Power Hour. I hope you enjoy the second half of our interview with Ramona Emerson.

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Thank you.

I remember when Elena and I first read the book a few months ago

and we were having a conversation and prep for the first interview.

And we were thinking like, what genre is this book, you know, and it's many it's what you just said right it's as much as it about

Ghosts and the paranormal and police procedural as it is about an indigenous almost like theory or an approach to history and memory that the because it's called shutter right and so it's already evocative of the frame, the photograph, as the way to kind of interpret the history and the memory. And yeah, the book is, it's funny we started this conversation talking about like goth style, the cure.

And like you're, when you all would like as teenagers go to the sub and see the smiths and you know all these bands.

It's a coming of age story in a way. It's also a mystery. It's also a thriller. It's like a crime thriller, but it's also like core and paranormal, but it's also like

like indigenous at the same time and so you somehow you manage to do all of those things at once in one book which is really rare.

I say really very exceptional I would argue that you're able to cross over those things.

And so that's just what your comment brought to mind because I can...

It's so, it's like a book that is very

authentic and immersive but it's almost like aware of itself in a way to that as somebody who is I'm not just like a I'm not just like a

a consumer I'm not like like just like a person reading the book but I am a person

who like studies our people's like literary and intellectual tradition and the history.

And I'm also like an organizer and an activist something very actively involved in kind of understanding the larger picture and the arc of things, kind of like moving

...