This is Hidden Killers with Tony Bruske.

Here now, Tony Bruske.

Oh, Donna Adelson, it's been an interesting first handful of days here in the trial.

We've seen a lot of people come and go off that stand.

It's had a distinctly different vibe, I think, than the Charlie Adelson trial where we saw the family being a little more, I don't know, it felt a little more tight-knit than this.

This time around, it seems that everyone is out for themselves.

Joining me to discuss Chavon Scott, psychotherapist, author of several books nightbird her new memoir it's out right now

wherever you get books in the minds of mass killers chavon uh we're watching quite an extraordinary

first handful of days like i said in this trial donna ailsen's own children wendy and the elusive

robert who we haven't seen

much of, they were up on the stand. And instead of circling the wagons, we're watching the fissures

pretty much open up. Wendy's still tangled and conflicted Robert. Blunt, almost cold in how he

describes his mother's control. It's a family unraveling in public.

I want to talk about what happens when children of narcissistic parents or parent finally

starts turning against them. When you see the adult children testifying in ways that clearly

undercut their mother, what does it tell you about how deeply the control is breaking down?

I think it's a wonderful thing because you're watching, you know, in real time,

the individuation process of these adult offspring, the Adelson kids.

And that's really what gives them the best hope for the future

is being able to separate from their

mother because they've had decades of her attempting to control them with emotional manipulation

and likely hysterical behavior. So looking at it from that vantage point as a clinician, this is

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