I'm John Batchler. Artificial intelligence, AI, dominating every conversation when it comes to investments, the future,

even the building of low Earth orbit into a data center for the AI demand that we have now and can anticipate.

However, we do not get very far away from an original challenge to those of us who practice AI and those of us who are reluctant,

which is the, what you'd have to say, the Manichaean universe of good and bad, bad AI because it's

going to lead to our doom, good AI because it's going to lead to our utopian ambitions.

Kevin Fraser is my guide on these matters since the beginning. He's an adjunct research fellow

at the Cato Institute, a senior fellow at the Abundance Institute, and director of the AI

Innovation and Law Program at the University of Texas School of Law in Austin, Texas. Kevin and I found

each other through the Civitas Institute that publishes the Civitas Outlook, where you can find

Kevin's most recent essay. It might feel fundamental, but it is true that AI is dominated by doomsayers,

some of whom are intimately informed because they were

there at the beginning of AI.

But Kevin, a very good evening to you.

There's the doomsayers and there's the utopians.

The Trump administration you call an accelerationist.

That sounds utopian, is it?

Good evening to you, Kevin.

Good evening, John.

It's a pleasure to join you, and I always

enjoy talking AI with you. I think when we are talking about the so-called two camps of AI policy,

yes, we have the accelerationists who are usually attributed with utopian visions of how AI can do

well for the future. Then we have some version of the

...