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This is John Batchel, a conversation with Edmund Fitton Brown,

former UK ambassador to Yemen, a long time UN official in the Middle East, especially the conflict zone, commenting on Iran's decision asymmetrical warfare to shut down by threatening with mines and missiles and drones, the Strait of Hormuz, critical to one-fifth of the

oil that the earth needs each day. Edmund is very straightforward. He uses the word piracy. He'll

explain. Iran shut it down. There are other problems to talk about, but it's Iran that is the

aggressor in threatening the rest of the planet.

Much more of this to deny.

It's very tricky.

And, you know, essentially the global economy is being held hostage by Iran in this area.

And we mustn't forget, it's Iran that is doing this.

Iran has a habit of interfering with the straight-of-hormuz. It's a completely illegal thing to do. And I think one of the

things that we must always keep in mind is that we are where we are now, partly because of

failure of previous, let's say the international community over decades, really to

face the Iranians down on this and to say, you know, what are you? Are you a member of the

community of nations or are you pirates? But, you know, you don't get to shut down international

...