Hey, it's Shane Parrish.

Welcome to a new episode of The Knowledge Project, where we deconstruct actionable strategies

that you can use to make better decisions, learn new things, and live a better life.

This time around, we have one of my dear

friends, Rory Sutherland. Rory is the vice chairman of Ogilvia Mather, one of the largest

advertising companies in the world. He's also co-founded their behavioral sciences practice,

which is applying behavioral insights to advertising. This interview was recorded live in London, England.

Rory and I talk about a host of subjects,

and I think you'll find his views,

his sense of mischief, and his insights well worth listening to.

A complete list of books and websites mentioned

is in the show notes at fernumstreetblog.com slash podcast. That's F-A-R-N-A-M-Sreetblog.com

slash podcast. A full transcript is also available for members of our learning tribe. If you want to

join, head over to Farnhamstreetblog.com slash tribe. In addition to transcripts, we have the world's best online

reading group and a host of other goodies. Without further ado, here's Rory.

Let's start with something maybe simple but not easy to answer, which is tell me a little bit about what you do on a day-to-day basis.

So having worked at Ogilvy and Mayther for 27 years, about four or five years ago, I started a division of the company called Ogleby Change, which has recruited sort of seven or

eight recent psychology graduates, or graduates from what may variously be called the decision

sciences nowadays, with a view to taking the best and most interesting work from behavioural economics, evolutionary psychology,

a little bit of complexity economics, I would argue, as well, and using that mental mug tree

of tools that are presented to us in those disciplines to solve problems that

conventionally advertising agencies haven't been asked to solve.

...