This is John Batchelor, conversation with Matt Pottinger, formerly the National Security Council, about China and the Biden administration,

and the difference between managing a competition and contesting a competition. When did it begin? Because as

Matt explains the early moments of the Biden administration continuing the tough

tariff talk on China and also extending

into cutting off China from the high-end semiconductors, all very successful, working

to push China away from its belligerence towards the region towards Taiwan?

And then, when did it start to become a detente minor, an imitation of the Soviet detente that sustained the Cold War in the 20th

century.

Meta identifies the moment itself.

It will surprise you. It's something you could see.

Matt Pottinger, formerly of the National Security Council now at the Hoover

Institution and the Foundation for the defense of democracies.

More of this later.

The real moment, John, when the Biden administration shifted from sustaining the Trump era policy, which I think was a good thing.

I law the Biden administration for sustaining Trump's tariffs, for deepening the export

controls that we put on China's semiconductor sector.

Ironically, the real shift occurred in early 2023

when a bunch of sharp-eyed citizens in the state of Montana

noticed a giant white orb flying over them.

It turned out to be a Chinese spy balloon that was flying over the United States.

The Biden administration had been aware of it and was planning to let it fly over the US without commenting on it.

You know, they've said that in part that was to study the balloon, but what it really signaled was this strange moment where the

...