This is John Batcher, conversation with colleague David Shedd, former acting director of the

direct defense intelligence agency, now commenting with Avon Estradner of the Foundation for the Defense of Democracy about how influence

peddling operations out of Moscow and Petersburg, out of Beijing and Shanghai, or and Pyongyang out of Tehran are used against American confidence

in its own government, especially what David I describes as the long game by China.

As David said to describe China's ambition using Tik-Tok and other social media sites to weaken the United States

over a great period of time, the 21st century, for example.

He refers to Avonestradner who can also speak to the Russian influence peddling

campaign to undermine confidence in our government directed not only at the United

States but our allies overseas.

Don't trust the U.S.

There's David Chet on China, long game.

More of this tonight.

China, really like Russia and to some extent Iran play the long game.

Their approach is to influence over time and this is my great concern for, of their ability to manipulate the information on Tik-Toc,

which is more often than not innocently posted by American citizens and promoted in such a way that it appears to be simply

for the purposes of exchanging views on various topics and that China then manipulates the

arrangements on Tik-Tok as a platform in promoting then certain themes as we have seen for example on the

question of Hamas and Israel.

But they play the long game and this I think John is important for the audience to understand and

Ivana can elaborate on it.

You don't see one single tweet or single X or a single platform posting, forcing a change of view,

but rather it's the multiplicity of it. And China is very much aware of that. And I think they're taking a page out of the Russian

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