This is John Bachelor, a conversation with my colleague David Maxwell, the Vice President for the

Center for Asia Pacific Security, about the visit by Vladimir Putin to Pyongyang to Kim Jong-Yang to Kim Jong-un, the exchange of mutual defense

pack folders.

At the same time, pledges that they will work together

in the event of aggression by unnamed sources. However, Mr. Putin points to the sanctions

regime. Both states are under sanctions for their bad acting and Mr. Putin regards the sanctions regime as a threat as a way of maintaining

hegemony, he says by the West.

What is to be done?

David Maxwell here describes very carefully the information space and what can be done, especially

towards Kim Jong-un, a very weak leader in a very broken state.

What is it that Mr. Kim Jong-un fears more than South Korea, the United

States, Tokyo, an alliance against him? What is he really fear? There's David Maxwell to answer

that question. More of this tonight. Yeah we need to have very measured rhetoric that

and we need this is this is where we need to talk softly and carry a big stick

we need to continue our high level of exercises demonstrating our military superiority, the readiness and capabilities of our forces.

But from an information perspective, this is where we need to really be wise. First of all all we must recognize Kim Jong-un

and Putin strategy understand it deeply and then expose it.

We've got to expose this strategy and part of exposing the strategy is exposing

their weaknesses and this is how we inoculate

uh... the press the the pundits the uh... policy makers in the public uh... to the actions of Russia and North Korea.

Expose that strategy and then attack it.

And we attack it using the information instrument of power and and

...