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This is John Batchel, a conversation with the author, Mark Clifford. His new book, The Troublemaker, The Story of Jimmy Lai,

who's now on trial pretty much for the rest of his life in China.

This is the background, where he came from, poverty in China, red China,

and became a billionaire.

And then, as Mark explains, he knew exactly what would happen to him when he went

up against the regime in Beijing as early as the early 1990s. Here's Mark Clifford to explain

the troublemaker. More of this, much more of this tonight. No, he knew what he was doing.

As far back as 1994, he had come under pressure from the Chinese because of an attack he wrote on the Chinese, the premier at the time, Le Pung, who was regarded as the butcher of Beijing for his role in the 1989 Tiananmen killings.

And Chinese authorities responded by closing the Giordano store in

Beijing on spurious grounds. They figured Jimmy would back off on the attacks. Instead, he doubled

down. He sold his stake in Giordano, pocketed a couple hundred million dollars, plowed that into

Apple Daily and started the newspaper so

he knew what he was up against the the the month of the handover i saw him on his stage and on a large

crowd and he started crying because he said i'm going to jail so he knew that the day would come

if he kept pushing if he kept being and these his words, the troublemaker, he was

...