Paul Manafort and How the Swamp Was Made

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The Atlantic

Politics, News, Society & Culture

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🗓️ 2 February 2018

⏱️ 54 minutes

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Summary

“Conventional wisdom suggests that the temptations of Washington, D.C., corrupt all the idealists, naïfs, and ingenues who settle there," Franklin Foer writes in his cover story for the March issue of The Atlantic. "But what if that formulation gets the causation backwards? What if it took an outsider to debase the capital and create the so-called swamp?” Before Paul Manafort led the campaign to position Donald Trump as the ultimate Washington outsider, Manafort had built a career on being the consummate D.C. insider. Foer tells the story of Manafort's rise and fall, his stint as a consigliere to oligarchs, and the lines he was willing to cross in lobbying and political consulting. Foer joins Jeff and Matt to describe how Manafort's career is a window into the rise of corruption in America. Links - “The Plot Against America” (Franklin Foer, March 2018 Issue) - “How the Swamp Drained Trump” (McKay Coppins, January 30, 2018) - “Dictatorships & Double Standards” (Jeane Kirkpatrick, Commentary, November 1, 1979) - The Soul of a New Machine (Tracy Kidder, 1981) - “Mackenzie Davis Answers the Tough Questions” (E. Alex Jung, Vulture, August 14, 2017) - Shop Class as Soulcraft (Matthew B. Crawford, 2010) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0	He doesn't exactly have a household name. In fact, until he became head of Donald Trump's presidential campaign, most Americans had probably never heard of Paul Manafort.
0:10.0	Now, he's been indicted on charges of conspiracy and money laundering by the Special Council Robert Mueller.
0:16.0	What does the rise and fall of Paul Manifort reveal about corruption around the world?
0:21.0	And what will it mean for the White House this is Radio Atlantic Hi, I'm Matt Thompson, Executive Editor of the Atlantic.
0:42.6	And with me in the studio in DC,
0:44.2	today is Jeffrey Goldberg, editor and chief of the Atlantic.
0:47.5	Hello, Jeffrey.
0:48.2	Hi, Matt.
0:50.1	And with both of us today is Franklin Four,
0:55.0	author of the Atlantic's March 2018 cover story,
1:00.2	The Plot Against America, about Paul Maniford. Frank, thanks for joining us.
1:06.1	Honored to be with you.
1:08.1	And honored?
1:09.1	Are you really honored?
1:10.1	Truly honored.
1:11.1	Not just superficially in that fake sort of way that I'm normally honored. truly not really really on it
1:13.0	really on it a way that I'm normally honored but the Washington way no no
1:17.2	we'll get to that this is beyond Washington honored all right we'll get to that
1:20.3	honored to have you at the table Alex Wagner Wagner, our co-host is off Gallivanting this week but will be back with us again next week.
1:27.6	Frank I want to start with a passage that appears deep in your story but is something he's
1:32.1	just doing that because to prove that he read your story
1:34.0	thesis of the story.
	...

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