Limited Atonement, CS Lewis, JD Hall & Phil Johnson
Soteriology 101 w/ Dr. Leighton Flowers
Leighton Flowers
4.8 • 826 Ratings
🗓️ 24 November 2014
⏱️ 75 minutes
🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS
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Summary
We quote and address CS Lewis, John Calvin, Charles Hodge, W.G.T Shedd, R. L. Dabney (Reformed Princeton Theologians), Phil Johnson (Grace to You) and JD Hall (Pulpit and Pen). Quotes below...
The first half of the podcast deals with Limited Atonement:
- Particular versus ProvisionalÂ
- One can support he provisional view without denying Calvinism.
- Not really the most important point of the Calvinistic debate yet it gets most of the attention.
- The bigger points of contention have to do with Total Inability and Irresistible Grace.
The second half of the podcast is my response to JD Hall's most recent podcast were we deal with the root cause for a regenerate man's choices.
God created things which had free will. That means creatures which can go wrong or right. Some people think they can imagine a creature which was free but had no possibility of going wrong, but I can't. If a thing is free to be good it's also free to be bad. And free will is what has made evil possible. Why, then, did God give them free will? Because free will, though it makes evil possible, is also the only thing that makes possible any love or goodness or joy worth having." - CS Lewis
It is a gross misrepresentation of the Augustinian doctrine to say that it teaches that Christ suffered so much for so many; that He would have suffered more had more been included in the purpose of salvation. This is not the doctrine of any Church on earth, and never has been. What was sufficient for one was sufficient for all...We affirm with Dort that no man perishes for want of atonement… –Charles Hodge
We reject the argument, If Christ made penal satisfaction for the sins of all, justice would forbid any to be punished… is incompatible with the facts that God chastises justified believers, and holds elect unbelievers subject to wrath till they believe. Christ's satisfaction is not a pecuniary equivalent, but only such a one as enables the Father, consistently with His attributes, to pardon, if in His mercy He sees fit. –Dabney
 "It may be asked: If atonement naturally and necessarily cancels guilt, why does not the vicarious atonement of Christ save all men indiscriminately, as the Universalist contends? The substituted suffering of Christ being infinite is equal in value to the personal suffering of all mankind; why then are not all men upon the same footing and in the class of the saved, by virtue of it? The answer is, Because it is a natural impossibility. Vicarious atonement without faith in it is powerless to save. It is not the making of this atonement, but the trusting in it, that saves the sinner. -Shedd
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Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | Another great show today. Going to interact a little bit more with J.D. Hall with pulpit and pin, as well as Phil Johnson in one of his sermons, as we tiptoe through the tulip and hit L. Limited Tomic. It's going to be fun. Let's dive in. never tell no lies. You're always telling me what it's all about, but some don't listen to your |
| 0:22.1 | replies. You say to us we can't do enough, and when I try, I'm a fool. This time I'm spent |
| 0:29.1 | and I've realized that I can't make it through. I need you. The words you say, your gracious |
| 0:35.5 | love just gives you away The words you say |
| 0:39.1 | You're so believable |
| 0:42.0 | Welcome to the Soteriology 101 podcast |
| 0:47.7 | With Professor Leighton Flowers |
| 0:50.1 | Join our online university classroom |
| 0:53.1 | As we discuss the doctrines of grace and God's amazing plan for salvation. |
| 0:59.0 | You're so believable. |
| 1:05.3 | You must be a universalist if you deny limited atonement, professor. |
| 1:10.1 | You're suggesting God wasted his blood on all those people in hell? |
| 1:13.8 | Seriously? |
| 1:14.5 | I hear what you're saying, Stewie. |
| 1:16.3 | That has a popular argument these days with the more neo-Calvinistic group. |
| 1:20.9 | But I think it misses the point. |
| 1:22.9 | I think it misses the underarching really major issue having to do with the concept of |
| 1:29.0 | atonement. First of all, let me just say the L in Tulip stands for limited |
| 1:33.8 | atonement. Now, even some Calvinists don't like that terminology. Some of them would |
| 1:38.3 | rather call it particular redemption. And really, the debate and the concept is over |
| 1:43.9 | whether Christ died for the sins of every |
| 1:48.3 | single individual or whether he died for only those he has eternally elected to be saved. |
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