This is Hidden Killers Live with Tony Bruske and Robin Dree.

The beginning of these relationships like Corey and Eric Richens can feel like the best thing that's ever happened to you.

The middle is where you start to lose yourself slowly, quietly, in ways that are hard to name.

You're not being hit,

maybe, maybe you are. Sometimes it's technically wrong. Sometimes something has shifted.

You can feel it even when you can't explain it. And the Corey Richens Kate's prosecutors paint a picture of a marriage where Eric was slowly being drained, emotionally, financially, physically, while holding a life together that he may not have fully recognized as a trap, this is the part of the relationship that nobody talks about.

With us to discuss Chavon Scott, psychotherapist and author, and Robin Drake, retired FBI specialin-chief of the counterintelligence behavioral analysis program.

There's a pattern in these relationships where the partner who gets targeted,

you start to feel responsible for the other's personal, emotional state.

Like, they're always one wrong word away from a blow up.

And you don't know why.

And you're hoping it's a phase and maybe this will change because they weren't always this way.

They didn't act like this at the beginning.

What's going on now?

Well, everybody goes through phases.

Everybody is ups and downs.

And when you're the partner of that, you're just trying to navigate it.

And then you discover, oh, this is more than just like a little like off a shoot where we're

navigating a small creek for a time. Oh, no, it's the ocean. And there's no land in sight.

And there's waves. And there's hurricanes. And there's tsunamis. And the man-eating octopus that's going to pop up at any given time

you just don't know when i come to it from experience so when you have that sort of dynamic going on

what's the name for it i mean and how does that get instilled in someone when you are the empathic partner,

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