Who was the original person that proposed the waterboarding idea and said this works?

And how did that person even find out how it works?

Was it accidental?

You know, the actual person is still unclear.

So, listen, I've read all of these guys' memoirs.

And I was there amongst them, and I didn't know.

So as it turned out, about a month after 9-11,

somebody went up to George Tenet at a cocktail party and said,

there are these two psychologists who worked for the Air Force,

and they've reverse engineered the seer training, the survival, evasion. It's a very intense. Very intense. And a lot of guys don't make it through. I was supposed to go to Seer Training. I never ended up. I got out of the Army. It's hideous. It's hideous. Yeah. Yes. So they've reversed engineered it. They break small bones. you know, you go through some, the POW type of training, they gas you to make sure you're

not going to leak information.

It's very intense.

Yeah.

And for $108 million, they can contract with us and implement it, and we're going to call it enhanced interrogation techniques.

And whoever it was, it was somebody either in the CIA's counterterrorism center

or somebody with proximity to the leadership of the counterterrorism center.

And so contracts were signed.

Now, I was in Pakistan at the time as the chief of CIA counterterrorism operations.

I had no idea, none of us did, that these conversations were taking place at headquarters.

And so, starting in Januaryuary of 2002 we began um hitting safe houses al-qaeda safe

houses and i still remember the first one i did we my first day in pakistan i went to

introduce myself to the station chief and he said here's what i want you to do i want you to come up with

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