And the Hi, I'm Bill Crystal. Welcome back to Conversations. I'm very pleased to be joined again today

by my friend Jim Caesar, distinguished political science professor at the University of

Virginia, student of American politics and the presidency, presidential selection, your

great first book, presidential elections, and we're speaking three weeks after our most recent presidential

elections.

So was it a big deal?

You edit books, don't you have co-added books every four years on the elections even?

I have since 1992. I'm not sure about this year but this one was as exciting in fact

more surprising than even 2000 which kept me up all night that were two or three different victors that night.

Right. This time I fell asleep thinking that it was all over. My wife didn't wake me up and at

about midnight I awoke and they were talking about the narrow path that Hillary still had. It was like

Rip Van Winkle in two hours awakening to a different world. So how big a deal? I

mean I guess that's the question right right? And in a certain way,

everyone says, oh, Trump, it's unbelievable. In a certain way, if you just came down from

Mars and looked at the electoral map, it's a little different. He did better than Romney among working class whites. He did less

well-known college educated, but basically the states he picked up with the

states you would have predicted a Republican would have to pick up mostly to win Ohio and Florida the two classic

swing states Iowa did it then he outperformed a little in the upper Midwest but I

guess I'm not mistaken six states total change is not like the map is

reversed you know it it's he lost the

popular vote as we speak here three weeks after looks like by I don't know two

and a half million votes. Not according to him. Yes well of course all the

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