Is the U.S. Experiencing a Narrative Shift on China?

Sinica Podcast

Kaiser Kuo

Culture, China News, Hangzhou, Chinese, International Relations, Chongqing, Beijing, Sichuan, Currentaffairs, China, Politics, Chengdu, Shanghai, Guangzhou, China Economy, News, China Politics, Business, Film, Shenzhen

4.8 • 676 Ratings

🗓️ 3 February 2025

⏱️ 62 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

This week as we enter the Year of the Snake, Sinica co-founder Jeremy Goldkorn makes a re-appearance on the show. It's been a year since his last, and much has changed — and indeed, if Jeremy is right, we may be at an inflection point in American attitudes toward China. With the "TikTok Refugees" on Xiaohongshu or "RedNote" taking in a view of China that contrasts starkly with the image presented by the U.S. Government and by many American media outlets, and with DeepSeek now having upended some ideas about American tech primacy, the "vibes" on China among young people seem to have changed for the better. Will it endure? Jeremy and I plunge into that question on this week's episode of the Sinica Podcast.

2:55 – What Jeremy has been up to lately

4:19 – What has been driving the recent narrative/vibe shift in China discourse in the U.S., and why human rights rhetoric around Xinjiang has died down

14:11 – Whether the narrative/vibe shift will be long-lasting and the role of young people in driving it

23:06 – Predictions for future changes within China

29:40 – The concern that the narrative/vibe shift could go too far, or that the copium will overwhelm the positive of the shift

33:24 – Previous narrative shifts around freedom of speech, the internet, and China, and technological innovation

43:57 – What recent developments reveal about Chinese soft power, and Jeremy’s predictions for how everything will play out

49:34 – Whether the narrative/vibe shift will change how American politicians talk about China, and the Chinese government has reacted to the shift so far

Paying It Forward: Savannah Billman’s Career China email newsletter

Recommendations:

Jeremy: Paul Cooper’s Fall of Civilizations podcast series; David Kidd’s Peking Story: The Last Days of Old China; and The 404’s podcast interview with a PornHub exec (which includes discussion of real-name registration requirements)

Kaiser: The TV miniseries American Primeval (2025) on Netflix; and Paul Triolo’s Substack

See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0	Welcome to the Cynica podcast, a weekly discussion of current affairs in China.
0:13.0	In this program, we'll look at books, ideas, new research, intellectual currents, and cultural trends
0:19.0	that can help us better understand what's happening in China's
0:21.4	politics, foreign relations, economics, and society. Join me each week for in-depth conversations
0:27.6	that shed more light and bring less heat to how we think and talk about China. I'm Kaiser Guo,
0:34.9	coming to you from Chapel Hill, North Carolina.
0:42.9	Cynica is supported this year by the Center for East Asian Studies at the University of Wisconsin-Madison,
0:46.2	a National Resource Center for the Study of East Asia.
0:52.5	The Cynica podcast will remain free, but if you work for an organization that believes in what I'm doing with the show, please consider lending your support.
0:55.3	You can get me at Cinecapod at gmail.com.
0:58.8	And listeners, please support my work at www.cenapodcast.com.
1:04.2	Become a subscriber and enjoy, in addition to the podcast, the complete transcript of the show,
1:10.3	essays from me as well as writings and
1:12.2	podcasts from some of your favorite China-focused columnists and commentators, with offerings
1:17.2	like the China Global South podcast from Eric Kobesinger Road, James Carter's This Week in
1:22.7	China's History, Paul French's Ultimate China Bookshelf, Andrew Methman's, Sinica, Chinese phrase of the week, and more.
1:29.9	And make sure to check out the latest series from our friends at Johns Hopkins Sice,
1:34.4	studying China in the absence of access, which will continue to run on the podcast feed and on the newsletter across the next few months.
1:43.5	The Chinese New Year holiday is upon us.
1:46.0	The year of the dragon is over.
1:47.5	The year of the snake begins.
1:49.2	And may it be a prosperous and happy one for all of you listeners.
	...

Please login to see the full transcript.

Previous episode | Next episode

Disclaimer: The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Kaiser Kuo, and are the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Tapesearch.

Generated transcripts are the property of Kaiser Kuo and are distributed freely under the Fair Use doctrine. Transcripts generated by Tapesearch are not guaranteed to be accurate.