Hey friends, the ex-Aleson-Babolon conference is happening again.

April 30th through May 2nd in Minneapolis, Minnesota.

We're talking about how we should think through artificial intelligence.

We're talking about immigration and the gospel, mental health in the gospel, and two dialogical

debates, one on Christians and War between Paul Copan

and Shane Claiborne. That's going to be, that's going to be exciting. And we're also having

a dialogical debate between Pete Enz and Sandy Richter, which is also going to be incredibly

invigorating. They're going to be discussing the historicity of the Bible.

All the information is at TheologyDraw.com. Register soon to take advantage of the early

bird special. Okay, my guest today is a former student of mine, which this might be the first

time I've had a former student of mine on the podcast. That might be a doctor, now Dr. Andrew Alara,

he holds a PhD from Duke University. He also went to Fuller Seminary. Before that, he was at

Eternity Bible College, where I used to teach. He is associate professor of biblical studies

and theology at the King's University in Edmonton, up in Canada. Andrew is the author of

the pot-stirring book, The Lamb of the Free, recovering the varied

sacrificial understandings of Jesus' death, which challenges the doctrine of penal

substitutionary atonement.

I wanted to have Andrew on to give him lots of time and space to unpack his views. The book is very, very thorough.

I would even say it's exegetically dense. It's a slow read. I mean, he's combing through text.

He's talking about Hebrew phrases at length. He's interacting with scholars. He has done a ton

of research and study on this topic. So whether you agree or not, I don't fully agree.

I would talk about that a little bit at the end. I'm not quite convinced, but I really appreciated

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