In defense of white-backlash politics

The Gray Area with Sean Illing

Vox Media Podcast Network

Society & Culture, News, Politics, News Commentary, Philosophy

4.6 • 10.8K Ratings

🗓️ 15 April 2019

⏱️ 96 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

“The big question of our time is less, ‘What does it mean to be American?’ than, ‘What does it mean to be white American in an age of ethnic change?’” writes Eric Kaufmann in his new book Whiteshift: Populism, Immigration, and the Future of White Majorities. Kaufmann’s book is unusual in two respects. First, it’s explicit (and persuasive) in its argument that demographic change and the white backlash to demographic change are behind the rise of rightwing populism across the West. Second, it argues that the right response is to slow demographic change and calm the fears of white majorities. I think Kaufmann’s framework of what’s driving political conflict right now is correct. I have more trouble with his vision of what to do about it. But this is a book, in my view, that gets to the core debate of contemporary politics and takes it on directly. That’s why I wanted to have this conversation. Book recommendations: The Ethnic Origins of Nationsby Anthony D. Smith The Cultural Contradictions Of Capitalismby Daniel Bell NEXT AMERICAN NATION: The New Nationalism and the Fourth American Revolutionby Michael Lind Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0	Conservatism is really about wanting the future to be like the past.
0:04.0	And authoritarianism is a preference for order and safety over diversity and change.
0:12.0	Hello, welcome to the Clancho on the Box Media Podcast Network.
0:24.0	So, let's listen to the show now that one of my obsessions is that a lot of our
0:28.0	political conflict right now happens on top of demographic change.
0:32.0	There were a country undergoing a quite historic shift, an historically rapid shift,
0:36.0	where our racial composition is changing, our religious composition is changing.
0:40.0	We are moving towards having a record share of Americans before and
0:44.0	born, our gender power dynamics are changing.
0:48.0	And that all this change forms the context for a lot of our political conflict,
0:52.0	the context that is only occasionally.
0:56.0	In fact, I think very rarely addressed on its own as opposed to its manifestations serving as the
1:02.0	zone of political conflict.
1:04.0	So, I'm always fascinated and interested to talk with other people who are trying to
1:08.0	address it on that level.
1:10.0	But in much of Europe as well, and the way it is eliciting a populist backlash.
1:14.0	And something I think is valuable about Eric's book, probably for somebody who
1:18.0	thinks about these things in the way I do, is that it on the one hand takes
1:22.0	that demographic change very seriously.
1:24.0	And on the other hand, it comes to some conclusions about it that I think are very
1:28.0	popular in our politics, but are rarely stated explicitly.
1:32.0	Conclusions about what white majorities will accept, conclusions about the ways in which they need to be
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