So, individual variability is everywhere, but in human society there is not a high level of tolerance for that.

Hello and welcome to the Psychology Podcast. Today we welcome Dr. Franz DeWal to the podcast.

Dr. DeWal is a Dutch American biologist and primatologist known for his work on the

behavior and social intelligence of primates. He is a professor in Emery University's

Psychology Department and the Director of the Living League Center at the Yerkes National

Primate Research Center. Chippen Z. Politics, The Age of Empathy, The Benobo, and The Atheist,

and Mama's Last Hug are among his most popular books that have been translated in over 20 languages.

His most recent book in the topic of our conversation today is called Different,

Gender Through the Eyes of a Primatologist. In this episode I talked to Franz DeWal about a very

emotionally charged topic among humans. Sex and Gender. As a primatologist he shares his unique

perspective and research findings on the biological differences between male and female primates.

Dr. Franz DeWal clears up what alpha male really means and debunks the natural order of male

supremacy. We also touch on the topics of socialization, power, altruism, reproduction, and equality.

Personally I found this a really interesting and fascinating conversation with a really

nuanced, thoughtful, reflective scientist. What I really like about his perspective is he doesn't

take any of these extreme stances that you tend to see today on Twitter, for instance,

and instead he really tries to think through what we can all learn from looking at other animals

about how to treat humans or fell humans. I found a really interesting, for instance,

that despite obvious distinctions between masculine and feminine behavior in great apes,

they have no trouble accepting non-gender conforming individuals. It's not the great ape that

needs to change, but it's the other great apes that showed tolerance to who the great ape

already is. I wish we saw a lot more of that kind of acceptance among humans. Let me tell you.

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