Ep. 210: Jon Bellion | Choosing Art Over Algorithm

And The Writer Is...with Ross Golan

And The Writer Is

Unknown, Music Interviews, Songwriting, Music, Songwriters, Education, Interviews, Music Creation, Artists

4.9 • 1.1K Ratings

🗓️ 13 May 2025

⏱️ 107 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

Today’s guest is one of the most original minds in modern music—a genre-defying powerhouse who returns to this podcast six years after his first unforgettable visit. Hailing from Long Island, this producer, performer, and lyrical architect has built a sonic universe entirely his own. He’s the mastermind behind cinematic pop records that blur the line between the underground and the mainstream, with a resume that spans from crafting platinum hits for chart-toppers to delivering soul-baring solo projects that redefine authenticity. Now a father of three, his creativity has only deepened, as he balances vulnerability and virtuosity with relentless hustle. He’s not just a hitmaker—he’s a visionary, a builder, and a storyteller for a generation that craves depth. And the writer is… Jon Bellion!

Episode Timestamps:

0:00 Bellion’s Return & Industry Fire

0:36 Ross ATWI Intro

2:05 Supporting Songwriters’ Rights

2:41 Jon Bellion Returns After 6 Years

3:56 Jon vs. the Algorithm

6:56 AI, Effort & Meaning

9:22 Craft Over Convenience

11:57 Identity, Process & Philosophy

18:21 Credit, Ego & Industry Power

25:32 Sponsor Message from NMPA

27:09 Staying Dangerous with Purpose

32:06 Becoming the Label

45:07 Removing Ego from the Process

50:41 Returning to Joy in Creation

54:58 Art vs. Math in Production

57:23 Hits Beyond the U.S.

1:05:16 On Raising Creative Kids

1:07:52 Jon's Words of Advice to His Younger Self

1:18:06 Grief, Healing & Writing Through Loss

1:22:32 What Success Really Means in 2025

1:25:00 Writing vs. Recognition

1:47:58 ATWI Credits & Closing Reflections

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Transcript

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0:00.0	I was never going to be an artist again, period.
0:02.0	Call capital the day, if you don't give me my master's and switch the ratio,
0:06.0	and I get the bulk of the masters, I'm never making a song again.
0:09.0	Ha, ha, ha, click.
0:10.0	Told my wife, I don't know how I'm going to make this work.
0:12.0	I'm just going to start writing songs again in the basement.
0:14.0	It just went crazy.
0:16.0	You gotta be careful to not get in the way of your own smashes sometimes. That's another thing I learned later on.
0:22.9	What was the situation that prompted you to write memories?
0:26.5	Went to my buddy's father's funeral, who passed away of a heart attack out of nowhere.
0:29.7	It's like feeling so much about the loss and the thing that made me think about my grandmother.
0:34.4	We did anyone for Reber and memories in the same day. Well, yeah. My wife was
0:39.2	like, what did you do today? It's like, we made some sort of just like simple. It's never going to
0:43.2	see the light of day. Wrong. I was so wrong. And then you fast forward and Kobe's daughter is like
0:48.8	singing it after he passes on ESPN. And I was like, oh my gosh, my ego almost got in the way of what that song was supposed to be.
0:56.0	Sometimes you gotta get the fuck out of the way of things that you're making.
0:59.0	Even your friends, even your heroes, even your people could be like, this sucks.
1:02.0	No matter how many hits somebody has or whatever, if my gut says that like this could be a big song.
1:06.0	Nobody knows shit.
1:07.0	It's like you have no control over the way culture receives these things. If you get the goosebumps when you're making it, go out to the world and that's your sword.
1:13.7	Pugh, I got the goosebumps.
1:14.9	The benefit that you've given us will only multiply 20-fold after we're all gone.
	...

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