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For The Love With Jen Hatmaker Podcast

Encore Matrescence: Unraveling the Myths and Realities of Being a Mother with Lucy Jones

For The Love With Jen Hatmaker Podcast

Jen Hatmaker

Relationships, Society & Culture

4.66.3K Ratings

🗓️ 9 May 2025

⏱️ 73 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

Description: …Today we’re revisiting the profound biological, psychological and social shifts experienced when becoming a mother - a process known as "matrescence.” Jen sits down with science journalist Lucy Jones, who experienced a seismic identity shift that arose after the birth of her first child.   Lucy and Jen unpack groundbreaking neuroscience research and they expose the deep-rooted myths and unrealistic expectations surrounding modern motherhood. From the minimizing of postpartum struggles to the pressure of "natural birthing" ideals, Lucy reveals how these systemic fictions can breed shame, isolation and maternal mental health crises. Jen and Lucy discuss: The concept of "matrescence" - the biological, psychological and social transition to becoming a mother that renders profound identity changes How modern cultural myths and idealized notions of motherhood as blissful and "natural" can be deeply alienating and contribute to maternal mental health issues The systemic lack of scientific research and societal rituals to prepare and support women through the seismic transformation of matrescence The need to construct new narratives, share vulnerable experiences, and build community care around the modern realities of the matrescence * * * Thought-Provoking Quotes: “[Matrescence] is a very simple concept that means the process of becoming a mother. The word is a little bit like 'adolescence'. It was coined by the late American anthropologist Dana Rafael in the 70's. She also coined the word 'doula'. She first wrote about it in an essay collection published in 1974 where she talks about how, in most societies and cultures across the world, people have always had a sense that a mother is born when a baby is born. But she also describes your identity, your social relationships, your roles, your everyday life, your mind, your psychology, and your emotions." - Lucy Jones Resources Mentioned in This Episode: Matrescence by Lucy Jones – Read here Foxes Unearthed by Lucy Jones – Read here Losing Eden by Lucy Jones – Read here Dana Raphael (American Anthropologist) – Learn more “The Birth of a Mother” by Alexandra Sacks (NYT article) – Read here 2017 NIH Study on Pregnancy and the Brain – Read here Of Woman Born by Adrienne Rich – Read here Andrea O’Reilly (Motherhood scholar) – Learn more Guest’s Links: Lucy’s Website: lucyfjones.com Lucy’s X: @lucyjones Instagram: @lucyfjones Facebook: Lucy Jones Books Connect with Jen!Jen’s Website - https://jenhatmaker.com/ Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/ Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.  To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

Hey everybody.

0:08.4

Welcome to the show.

0:09.5

Good morning.

0:10.6

Wherever you are at.

0:11.7

Isn't it sometimes fun to think about where the listeners are?

0:14.4

Like, where are the people when they listen to a show?

0:17.9

Are they in their car?

0:19.5

Are they folding laundry? Oh, yeah. Like, you know,

0:24.0

doing a menial task with your air buds in? Are they on a treadmill? Walking the dog. Walking the dog,

0:31.3

that's a good one. Probably always multitasking. No one is just sitting in a chair, staring into space, listening to an

0:40.4

episode. I wish for them that they could. I do too. Gazing, as Father Roar told us. Gazing and listening.

0:47.4

Just gazing is, sounds lovely, but no one's doing that. They're listening with half an ear while

0:53.3

they're like driving to soccer maybe, or I think I've said this before, but when I listen to podcasts, it's pretty

1:00.7

singular. I listen to podcasts while I get my eyelashes done. You know, I go and I get my eyelashes

1:09.7

done. You know, they glue them on one at

1:10.9

a time, like just some sort of idiot. Is this true? You catch up? Well, I don't have a giant array of

1:17.7

podcasts that I listen to. Um, so I listen to, okay, would you like to know my podcast situation? Yes.

1:31.3

I am pretty focused. my eyelash appointment podcast is smartless okay and it keeps me close to being up so i'll that gets me about one and a half

1:40.8

um and so i enjoy that one so much.

1:46.3

I did know that was your number one.

1:47.8

Yeah, I just enjoy the banter.

1:50.7

I like those friends.

...

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