Oh, Andrew, I have been waiting for this one for a long time because, yes, I am excited to talk

to Jay Dobbins, who will talk about in just a second, but I'm also excited for you to talk to

Jay Dobbins because this is another one of those interviews that is Andrew Eiden Katnip.

Yeah, I have long had a fascination with biker culture and outlaw biker

gangs and just kind of the whole universe. And Jay Dobbins spent years working for the Bureau of

Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms, ATF, and he infiltrated the Hells Angels and worked

on the other side of the wall as a undercover operative. Let's pause and just let that process

for a second. Let's repeat it for a second. He, as a member of the ATF, joined the Hells Angels as an

undercover agent and led a large undercover operation

that took a whole lot of them down. Yeah. And in the Outlaw Biker Universe, there is no one

bigger than the Hells Angels. They are the mythical group. I mean, there's a ton of gangs,

biker gangs like this, but nobody has gotten more publicity or more run than the Hells Angels.

And Jay managed to get through that wall and earn the trust of those guys and had fascinating, fascinating stories.

Even before that happened, he was a legend.

I mean, he was involved in such historical crime cases, you know, from Oklahoma City to Columbine.

Yeah, before he even gets to wearing the vest, he's at Waco, he's at Oklahoma City, he's at Columbine. He's got this amazing career of really defining events in American, you know, history.

Yeah. And before that, he was a stark college football player. I mean, he is a fascinating character. And when you talk to him, he's really humble about it all, right? Like he, he's the first

to say, I'm no big deal. I would say that we would humbly disagree. Indeed. So, here's Jay Dobbins,

also known as Jay Bird Davis. So, Jay, knowing kind of your story and knowing your life, it's kind of hard to figure out where to start.

Let's just go ahead and start with how did you get into law enforcement and how did you get into biker gang culture, the hells angels,

the whole thing? Let's just go ahead and start there.

Well, you know, to be honest with you, a lot of it was by accident. I started in law

...