Welcome to the Enigram journey. My guest today is my friend Nautia Bulls Weber.

She's an aid on the anyagram, an astonishing writer, a woman who's accomplished a great deal.

For people who are marginalized and looking for their place. She in her aateness has been seeking justice since I met her and she seeks it now in different ways sometimes.

So I'm so excited that you're on the Andy Graham journey and I am going to try really hard to listen

far more than I talk.

Sometimes when we're together I get to talking too much and I want everybody to get to hear you.

So I want to start with this question.

What would you say is the most valuable thing the any gram has offered you? I think honest self-assessment in the sense of sometimes our opinions of ourselves can devolve into really unhealthy self-loathing.

And I feel that also we can err on the side of absurd

positivity. Like we can't we shouldn't ever feel bad about anything about ourselves and well that's not

entirely true either if you believe in sin right like we all have stuff that that you know we all have a dark side and a light

a light side and we all have a light side.

So I think the Enigram has given me language

for what my theology already was honestly which is that we're

simultaneously center and saint. I have that tattooed in Latin on my wrist right?

Simile used to set Picatin. So this idea that we have that we have

this sort of dual nature in a sense and the Eniagram gives me just

incredible language for that reality in my life and other people's lives.

Yeah, you know, I think I can remember when I was younger over apologizing for the weaknesses in my tunis and

overvaluing the strengths in my tunis.

And I wonder if that kind of comparison within ourselves leads us to

comparison with others, which always leads to competition which always leads to

...