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🗓️ 8 January 2015
⏱️ 59 minutes
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There is a podcast called "Theology Unplugged" with a group of Calvinistic brothers (Tim Kimberely, JJ Seid and Sam Storms) from Credo House Ministries in Oklahoma. In their most recent podcast titled, "Does God Choose People to Go to Hell," they discuss the issue of double predestination as it relates to the Calvinistic interpretation of Romans 9.
As is typical, they paint all non-Calvinists as believing the "foresight faith view" of election and thus never give a strong rebuttal to the most widely held scholarly perspective opposing their Calvinistic interpretation.
They are honest about the difficulties of the text and are sincere in their efforts to interpret God's Word. However, they have misapplied the intention of Paul in Romans 9-11 to support their individualistic soteriological perspective causing unnecessary difficulty in accepting the text.
As a Calvinist, I had to learn that "the foresight faith view" was not the only scholarly alternative to the Calvinistic interpretation.
I had so saturated myself with Calvinistic preachers and authors that the only thing I knew of the opposing views was what they told me. Thus, I had been lead to believe the only real alternative to Calvinism was this strange concept of God “looking through the corridors of time to elect those He foresees would choose Him.” Notable Calvinistic teachers almost always paint all non-Calvinistic scholars as holding to this perspective. Once I realized I had been misled on this point, I was more open to consider other interpretations objectively.
I found a much more robust and theologically sound systematic in what is called "The Corporate View of Election," which so happened to be the most popular view among the biblical scholars of my own denomination (Southern Baptists). Much more can be said about this view that I will not take the liberty to expound upon in this article. However, I must warn readers that the all too common phrase, “nations are made up of individuals too,” does not even begin to rebut the claims of this perspective. Individuals are just as much involved in the Corporate perspective as they are the Calvinistic perspective (maybe even more so). Anyone who believes the Corporate view is easily dismissed with that simple one-liner has not yet come to understand it rightly. In my experience, very few Calvinists give this view the attention it deserves because it requires a shift in perspective that, if recognized, would undermine their entire premise.
Do you understand “The Corporate View of Election”…I mean really understand it? Could you defend it in a debate if you had to? Could you explain it objectively to a classroom of students? Are you willing to study it and evaluate its claims?
“It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.” -Aristotle
KEY POINT: God DOES use determinative means to ensure His sovereign purposes in electing Israel, which includes:
However, there is no indication in scripture that:
As a Calvinist I did not understand the historical context of the scriptures as it relates to the national election of Israel followed by their judicial hardening. When the scriptures spoke of Jesus hiding the truth in parables, or only revealing Himself to a select few, or cutting off large numbers of people from seeing, hearing and understanding the truth; I immediately presumed that those were passages supporting the “T” of my T.U.L.I.P. when in reality they are supporting the doctrine of Israel’s judicial hardening.
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0:00.0 | We've got a great program. Today we're going to look at the Theology Unplugged podcast produced by Cretto House, where they talk about double predestination. It's going to be a lot of fun. Let's dive in. |
0:14.0 | You answer all my questions. You can never tell no lies. You're always telling me what it's all about, but some don't listen to your |
0:22.1 | replies. You say to us we can't do enough, and when I try, I'm a fool. This time I'm spent |
0:29.1 | and I've realized that I can't make it through. I need you. The words you say, your gracious |
0:35.5 | love just gives you away The words you say |
0:39.1 | You're so believable |
0:42.0 | Welcome to the Sotiorology 101 podcast |
0:47.7 | With Professor Leighton Flowers |
0:50.1 | Join our online university classroom |
0:53.1 | As we discuss the doctrines of grace and God's amazing plan for salvation. |
0:58.7 | You're so believable. |
1:02.6 | I am totally confused. Are we talking about predestination election or are we focusing in on the issue of double predestination? |
1:11.6 | Well, I mean, it's all in the same camp, right? |
1:13.6 | I know, but how can we cover both? |
1:15.6 | Well, the issue is, is that our Armenian brothers and sisters, and we do regard them as brothers and sisters within the family of faith. |
1:22.6 | And I think we threw out that term Armenian without really much explanation for a crime. |
1:25.6 | Well, James Arminius, second generation reformer, died in I think about 1609, I believe, somewhere |
1:33.5 | long in there, was a disciple of Theodore Beza, who was kind of the systematizer of Calvin's |
1:41.3 | thought. |
1:42.3 | Arminius basically argued, as Tim just said, that yes, God elects, |
1:45.3 | but it's based on his foreknowledge or his foresight of who will, by free act of faith, believe in |
1:51.2 | Jesus. Those of us at this table believe in unconditional election, that if God's election |
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