Hello there I'm Chuck Todd and this is the Chuck Todd cast so by all indications

artificial intelligence is getting exponentially more intelligence as the months

past and just this week the godfather of AI Jeffrey Hinton left Google warning

that the science hasn't caught up to the engineering, meaning the AI has

officially gotten smarter than people, and in July Google fired an engineer who

claimed an unreleased AI system had become sentendant. The ethical pitfalls ahead of us seem enormous. So joining me now to discuss this.

J.C. Reese Anthes, who argues we need an AI rights movement. He's a sociologist focused on the rise of AI, he's co-founder of the Sentinence Institute,

a word that I hate pronouncing a lot, which is a non-profit think tank focused on digital minds, research,

Sir J.C. apologies for my inability to pronounce the word sentinents.

It's all right, I've had a lot of practice.

It is, it is one of those words you're like as long as I'm not selling

seashells by the seashore for Sally and her sentiments. Let me start with that fact that I set up top because I feel like like most everybody in Washington I've

been doing a cross course in AI. I've certainly met with a lot of experts. There's a lot of

experts trying to shape public opinion in Washington as you might imagine and

the scariest thing I heard was from a Google engineer who said yeah the

engineering is ahead of the science and meaning we can't explain the outcomes that AI is getting now. He goes, it's

really exciting and really scary. That is a HAL moment there, JC, to reference an old

movie in my generation.

Yeah, there maybe three ways we can build things.

We can engineer them, as you said.

We can do them scientifically.

If you hear about the olden days of AI in the late 1900s, it was about building expert systems,

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