Cognitive Behavioral Tools for FI With Jasper Lee, PhD | Ep 573

ChooseFI

Brad Barrett | Choose FI Media

Business, Careers, Investing

4.8 • 5K Ratings

🗓️ 17 November 2025

⏱️ 67 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

Show Notes

Guest: Jasper Lee, PhD - Clinical Psychologist
Episode Summary: In this episode, Jasper Lee discusses the psychological elements that impact the journey to financial independence (FI). He provides actionable insights on dealing with emotions and behaviors that influence financial decisions, emphasizing cognitive restructuring and behavioral activation as key strategies.

Key Takeaways

Psychology in FI: 90-95% of the FI journey is psychological, with the remaining being about the mechanics of money.
Understanding Money Scripts: Early lessons about money shape adult attitudes; awareness of these scripts can help shift unhelpful patterns.
Cognitive Restructuring: Challenge unhelpful thoughts to foster a healthier money mindset.
Behavioral Activation: Engage in activities that bring joy and fulfillment to enhance emotional well-being.

Timestamps & Insights

Introduction to Jasper Lee
- Overview of Jasper's qualifications and focus on the intersection of psychology and FI.
Psychology and Financial Independence
- Key Quote: "Psychology comprises 90-95% of the FI journey."
- Discussion on how our emotions and thoughts relate to financial strategies.
Understanding Money Scripts
- Key Quote: "Childhood experiences shape our adult relationships with money."
- The Klontz Money Script Inventory helps identify personal money scripts.
Cognitive Restructuring Explained
- Key Quote: "Identify and challenge unhelpful thought patterns to reduce anxiety about money."
- Techniques for restructing thoughts include evidence for vs. against, and balanced thinking.
Behavioral Activation Insights
- Key Quote: "Engage in activities that enrich your life."
- Importance of balancing accomplishment, pleasure, social interactions, and physical activities.
Closure and Resources
- Suggested resource: The Happiness Trap by Russ Harris for further exploration of acceptance and commitment strategies.

Actionable Takeaways

Engagement Experimentation: Reflect on week-long activities and assess which bring joy. (Timestamp: )
Cognitive Restructuring Practice: Challenge and replace unhelpful thoughts with balanced perspectives. (Timestamp: )

Discussion Questions

What financial beliefs did you inherit from your childhood? (Timestamp: )
How do your thoughts affect your financial decisions? (Timestamp: )

Klontz Money Script Test: Take the Test (Timestamp: )
The Happiness Trap by Russ Harris: Read Here (Timestamp: )
Jasper Lee's website: jasperleephd.com

Transcript

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0:00.0	Hello and welcome to Chusify. Today in the show, we have a really interesting episode.
0:04.6	Jasper Lee is a PhD in clinical psychology and an assistant professor at Harvard Medical School
0:10.1	and a staff psychologist at Massachusetts General Hospital. He's an NIH-funded researcher
0:15.4	and has a private practice where, among other things, he works with folks on the psychological
0:20.5	components of
0:21.4	Phi. He reached out to me and basically said, hey, Brad, you constantly talk about the intersection
0:27.6	of psychology in Phi, and I wondered if you'd ever want to license clinical psychologist on
0:32.7	as a guest. So naturally, I jumped on this and thought it would be an absolutely fantastic episode because,
0:39.1	as I'd say often here at the podcast, FI is, in my estimation, 90 to 95 percent psychological,
0:46.2	and the actual nuts and bolts of money are maybe five or 10 percent of this.
0:50.4	So Jasper came on.
0:52.2	He had a wealth of knowledge.
0:53.4	We talk about a ton of things, including
0:55.9	specifically problem solving and using two different tools, cognitive restructuring and behavioral
1:01.3	activation that I found fascinating and incredibly actionable. This episode is chock full of actionable
1:08.6	tidbits. So I'm going to leave it there. I know you're going to
1:11.3	enjoy this. And with that, welcome to choose that fI. Before we get started, I keep this podcast
1:23.6	entirely ad-free for two reasons. First, this is a five podcast and I don't want to promote
1:28.4	products that I don't want you to buy in the first place. And second, I really like the clean
1:33.2	listening experience of a show where you don't have to fast forward ads. To keep it ad-free,
1:38.1	all I ask of you as a listener is the next time you open a travel rewards credit card,
1:42.2	go to choosefi.com slash cards and with that
	...

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