ChatGPT chief Nick Turley doesn't want you too attached to AI

Decoder with Nilay Patel

Vox Media Podcast Network

Technology, Business

4.3 • 3.2K Ratings

🗓️ 14 August 2025

⏱️ 56 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

This is Alex Heath, your Thursday episode guest host and deputy editor at The Verge. Today, I’m talking to a very special guest: Nick Turley, OpenAI’s head of ChatGPT. While Sam Altman is definitely the public face of OpenAI, Nick has been leading ChatGPT’s development since the very beginning, and it’s now the fastest-growing software product of all time with more than 700 million weekly users. So, Nick and I talk about the backlash against OpenAI’s removal of its GPT-4o model, the future of ChatGPT itself, solving hallucinations, and why he thinks it eventually won’t look like a chatbot at all. Links: ChatGPT won’t remove old models without warning after GPT-5 backlash | Verge ChatGPT is bringing back 4o as an option because people missed it | Verge GPT-5 is being released to all ChatGPT users | Verge The 6 biggest changes coming to ChatGPT | Verge ChatGPT has 20 million paying subscribers | Verge Elon Musk says he’s suing Apple for rigging App Store rankings | Verge OpenAI’s ChatGPT to hit 700 million weekly users | CNBC Chatbots can go into a delusional spiral. Here’s how it happens | NYT ChatGPT gave instructions for murder, self-mutilation, and devil worship | The Atlantic ‘I feel like I’m going crazy’: ChatGPT fuels delusional spirals | WSJ Credits: Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. This episode was edited by Xander Adams. The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0	Support for this show comes from Robin Hood.
0:03.4	Wouldn't it be great to manage your portfolio on one platform?
0:07.2	With Robin Hood, not only can you trade individual stocks and ETFs,
0:11.1	you can also seamlessly buy and sell crypto at low costs.
0:15.0	Trade all in one place.
0:16.5	Get started now on Robin Hood.
0:18.7	Trading crypto involves significant risk.
0:21.7	Crypto trading is offered through an account with Robin Hood Crypto LLC. Robin Hood Crypto is licensed to engage in
0:26.2	virtual currency business activity by the New York State Department of Financial Services. Crypto held
0:30.6	through Robin Hood Crypto is not FDIC in short or CIPICP-POTECT. Investing involves risk,
0:35.1	including loss of principle. Securities trading is offered through an account with
0:38.3	Robin Hood Financial LLC, Member SIPIC, a registered broker dealer.
0:46.1	Powders, pills, plunges, everywhere you look, there seems to be a new wellness trend.
0:52.7	I think, like, also, we all want to feel good.
0:55.5	And if there's a way to feel better, I think, wouldn't you want to try it?
0:58.6	I would.
0:59.7	What's the cost of being well?
1:01.4	And why are we so obsessed with it in the first place?
1:05.1	That's this week on Explain It to Me.
1:07.3	New episodes every Sunday, wherever you get your podcasts.
1:19.0	Thank you. New episodes every Sunday, wherever you get your podcasts. Would you rather have good laws or good people?
1:24.0	I think that justice is a direction rather than a destination. I don't think you
	...

Transcript will be available on the free plan in 27 days. Upgrade to see the full transcript now.

Previous episode

Disclaimer: The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Vox Media Podcast Network, and are the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Tapesearch.

Generated transcripts are the property of Vox Media Podcast Network and are distributed freely under the Fair Use doctrine. Transcripts generated by Tapesearch are not guaranteed to be accurate.