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In this edition of the bottom line, Evan Davis asks his guests about capitalism and reaching your prime in business.

Hello, we're back with a brand new series of business conversations.

And today I'll ask my guests about the big issue at the moment, capitalism, its virtues and vices.

In the papers, you'll see the word capitalism associated with negatives like crisis or crony. I'll ask my three business guests

how they would redesign and rebrand capitalism. And I'm also going to ask them if they're

past their prime. When exactly do you peak in business?

But let's spend a few minutes meeting each of those guests first.

And first up in the roster is Keith Clark returning to the program,

former chief executive of Atkins, one of the world's largest civil engineering and design consultancies.

And Keith, now you're chairman of the Middle East operations.

And we're going to talk about your career and role there a little later. I just wanted to talk about

the Olympics. Very briefly, though, because you designed quite a bit, or the company designed quite a bit of the Olympic Park.

We're doing the temporary overlay of the infrastructure, and we did about half the infrastructure on site, which went extremely well. Like all things in good engineering, you never hear about it when it goes well. And we're very proud to say you don't hear about our stuff. Actually, the question I was going to ask is, did you manage to get any Olympic tickets? Because they're obviously the... I managed to buy some on the internet, just the same as everybody else else from the normal lottery, but not the corporate tickets. And actually it's very difficult to even give away. I can't invite my ministers from Qatar, who I'm advising now on their infrastructure, because it's a conflict of interest. You can't ask public officials to these things. So these corporations aren't going to be able to give these things away because it'll be corruption, crony capitalism. It will be crony capitalism, particularly clients who are hiring you for expertise. If you're bidding on something competitively is one thing. But when you're being hired as a professional for judgment, it's very difficult to invite people to something like that, which is worth a lot of money. I mean these these are not cheap tickets by saying you fly them. And then it becomes difficult. So actually, we will be quite, I think, unfriendly to our clients because they hire us for quality. And repeatedly we win not on price but on quality. Thank you for that. Next up, Deborah Meadden, who made her money in holiday parks, famous, of course, as one of the Dragons from that TV programme. I'm vaguely familiar with, Dragons Den. Deborah, what are you investing in these days? Of course, investing is a lot of what you do now. Absolutely, that's what I spend my time doing. But I'm interestingly, I've seen a lot of opportunity in helping businesses behave in a more sustainable

way. So I've got a business, for instance, called Economy that is a piece of software

that encourages good behavioural change.

Economy, give me the customer experience. How does it work? What will be a typical transaction?

So I would be working inside an organisation. I would be asked to do something differently,

probably to stop waste.

I would tell the piece of software, this is what I've done.

The company would keep 50, 60, 70, 80% of the savings that I've generated, and the rest get dropped into a pot.

And either I or my workmates can come together and say, you know what, we want to build a playground for the local school. And that cash then goes towards those community projects. So it's like a reward scheme, corporate reward scheme, with a lot of the rewards going off to a local... It's a social, absolutely, a social thing, which, you know, to me that goes to the heart of what we're talking about today. And by the way, I am a sustainability ambassador for the Olympics,

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