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But, and this apply, what I'm about to say applies to the Chinese version of this and to the

Western, you know, whatever it is to the whole world, what is much more difficult is to destroy value, to destroy

property. Like, you can open up new arenas of consumption of competition of production. Green stuff,

let's buy that and make that. What's harder is to destroy the actual polluting infrastructure.

And as per your point about conglomerates and finance,

the fact that our financial system is heavily invested in fossil capitalism means that it might

presage like a financial crisis if we destroyed all that value. And it would actually be intentional.

It wouldn't be like a bubble bursting like we're talking about with AI or past real estate crises. It would be like government driven intentional destruction of value.

And if you want to feel depressed, I would actually suggest reading overshoot. My book is less

depressing than that book, which really gets into like what it would take to destroy the value

of the fossil fuel industry, which is necessary to

prevent further investment in it.

I mean, this really speaks to where we're at, right? The argument from fossil fuel companies

who don't want to just say, let's keep rolling coal forever, which is what they really want to do,

but they can't say that now because it's not,

that's not what the public is geared up to here.

But the argument is we have to keep burning oil and gas,

because if we don't do that, then as you say,

the economy that we've built around these things will collapse

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