Hello and welcome to a very special bonus episode of Little Gold Men.

I'm Katie Rich, the deputy editor of Vanity Fair.com, but I'm not who you're here to listen to.

We are sharing the full conversation between Sonia Soraya,

our TV critic, and Joe Pompeo, the media writer

for Vanity Fair's The Hive.

They had a conversation about the Showtime documentaries,

the Fourth Estate, all about life inside the New York Times.

And as you'll here, they have a lot of insight

both as a television watcher and Sonia,

who knows how documentaries work,

and then Joe is a media reporter who knows

a lot about what goes on inside the New York Times and have some really interesting questions

about how it works for average viewers to see it, what it's like to see stars like Maggie

Haberman and Michael Barb Barrow in real life.

We didn't want you to miss out on hearing the whole thing, so here it is.

Hello and welcome to a special edition of Little Gold Men.

I'm Sonia Soraya, Vanity Ferris Television Critic,

and I want to talk about the fourth estate,

a four-part docu series on Showtime,

which covers the first year of the Trump administration through the eyes of the New York Times newsroom.

It's a really interesting view into the New York Times, but one of the things that's so interesting about it, as I wrote in my review,

is that it's kind of lopsided too, that there are some things about it that are really intimate,

...